L.R. Baggs Dual-Source Mic/Pickup Mixer

L.R. Baggs Dual Source pickup w/ internal mic and undersaddle pickup. On board control is a small kidney bean-shaped nodule attached to the upper side of the sound hole (non-damaging, removeable) w/ two controls; usually volume and EQ. Mine is a slighty different model w/ basic volume and mic volume control. A small and discreet preamp mounts inside the guitar, on the back. Powered by a 9-volt in a small pouch inside the instrument, attached via velcro to the neck mount. There's a small LED battery life light on the control. Output impedence is 1200 Ohm. No onboard tuner.

I used it on a 2000 Tacoma PK30. It was professionally installed and other than inserting a jack, no modification was needed. The preamp and battery pouch are afixed w/ adhesive, so they're non-destructive, and the control nodule can be removed and attached in a few seconds w/ no damage. There was no pickup in the guitar previously. Tom Anderson, from Tom Anderson Guitars, and David Wilcox have both praised this pickup as being one of the best they've ever heard.

The output is nice and hot, but not overpowering. You can usually get all the volume you need by turning the volume up half way. Tone is fantastic - it's one of the best amplified acoustic sounds you'll find. I'll either play it direct through the house w/ chorus or reverb added at the sound board, or run through a smiple DigiTech acoustic pedal. Either way it's full, warm and strong.

If I lost it, I'd want to replace it. If I didn't grab another Dual Source, I'd at least stick w/ L.R. Baggs. Their stuff is great. I've been playing for around 15 years, mostly acoustic, and this is absolutely one of the best amplified acoustic sounds I've come across. I've used Gibson acoustics through mics, a couple Takamines w/ Fishman systems, an Ovation, a couple Martins w/ Fishmans and Taylors with Taylor's Expression System, and you really just can't beat this one. It's a great pickup.

Pickup features: It is an active pickup
Impedence or other specs:

Model of guitar or bass: Breedlove SC25/Koa
Position: bridge
Pickup being replaced: None
Other pickups on guitar: None
Artists using this pickup:
You musical style(s): Praise and Worship, contemporary Christian
Reason for pickup change: No Change

Perceived output level: Output level is very good. Good volume. Balanced.
Tone: Balanced.
Sonic evaluation: I use the Crate CA-30D, or at church it goes through a direct box to the mixer.

For which styles and positions is this pickup (un)suitable: Praise and worship, contemporary christian

Comments: I have been playing 31 years, off and on. I own a Taylor 912CE L7, a Breedlove SC25/K, a Larrivee LV-03Re, and a Taylor 514CE. I love the sound it projects, but hate the fact that the battery is so hard to change. You either have to loosen up the strings considerably, and that only if your hand is small enough, or you have to change it with the strings off. They could improve upon this if they made the battery easier to change. Also, the pouch where the battery goes points down when playing. It would be better if it pointed up, so as not to create worry that it will fall out and do some damage. It does have a velcro flap, but with the battery installed there's not a lot of flap left to grip the velcro on the pouch.

Pickup features: An undersaddle/mic combo mixing unit (onboard)
Impedence or other specs: High Output

Model of guitar or bass: Blueridge BR-160 (spruce, rosewood dread)
Position: all positions
Pickup being replaced: N/A
Other pickups on guitar: N/A
Artists using this pickup: Quite a few
You musical style(s): Blues, Bluegrass, Contemporary Acoustic Music
Reason for pickup change: I didnt actually have a pickup on the guitar, and really had no reason to put one on the guitar other than the fact that I like to be able to play all of my instruments through some sort of amp if necessary.

Perceived output level: The output of this pickup system is very hot, in fact I tried playing through a Baggs Para DI and found that the added gain from the Para DI was actually too much. Its that hot!!
Tone: The tone of this pickup system has really surprised me. I bought it expecting a little "quackiness" that UST's generally have, but to be perfectly honest even with the microphone turned all the way down, and its just the UST, its just not that quacky. But then you blend in the mic and man are you talking about a good sound. This is probably the best sounding acoustic pickup system that i have heard.
Sonic evaluation: I play through a 100 watt pa system, and i play into my computer and record.

For which styles and positions is this pickup (un)suitable: I cant really think of any genre where this pickup would not work. I mean unless the guitarist is just wanting an "unnatural" sound, then this pickup would not be for that person. If you are a guitarist that is wanting a pickup system that sounds great, and gives a good overall natural guitar sound, then this is for you, simply said.

Comments: If this setup were stolen I would definitely buy it again. I love the sound of the pickup. I just love the UST/Mic combination from an acoustic guitar. I mean of course this does not have the sound of playing through a $3000 neumann, but i mean it cant be too far off. Simply put it just sounds really good. I compared it to the Fishman Pocket Blender System. That sounded ok, but the Acoustic Matrix II UST has to be one of the worst sounding pickups I have ever heard. Youll never explain to me why anybody wold pay the money those things cost. They sound awful. But Iwould advise anyone reading this to give this pickup system a shot, I could almost guarantee you would not be disappointed.

Pickup features: Mic / Under saddle transducer w/ preamp / blender
Impedence or other specs:

Model of guitar or bass: Gibson CL20
Position: all positions
Pickup being replaced: Fishman System w/ mic and matrix and external Acoustic Blender
Other pickups on guitar:
Artists using this pickup: Wes King
You musical style(s): Solo acoustic and rock / pop with band
Reason for pickup change: Desire to achieve a good acoustic sound with blended onboard mic and transducer with no or less external equipment

Perceived output level: not as hot as the Fishman system
Tone: balanced and versatile
Sonic evaluation: In about 1996 I installed the Fishman Acoustic Matrix undersaddle transducer and internal mic system into my 1995 Gibson CL20 controlled with the outboard Acoustic Blender. I did like the sound and control the blender provided but I regularly found myself plugging straight into the snake or board from the guitar which, with the Fishman, enabled only the undersaddle transducer. This was often the case to avoid having to set up the Acoustic Blender and get power to it and ect. I was, and still am, a Wes King fan and he came to town around '98-99 touring by himself. I liked his sound and he showed me his guitar with the LR Baggs Duet II installed and he raved about how great it was. I began to research LR Baggs and saw they now had out the Dual Source with the little Remote Control soundhole controller which I felt would be comparable to the Duet and cheaper and easier to install myself. All my assumptions were correct. I installed the Dual Source myself and got , in my opinion, an improved sound over the entire Fisman rig. The mic is the main difference, with the different placement from the Fishman I found it mellower, not as bright and harsh and gives a nice woody tone. After about a year I began to not like the Baggs ribbon transducer so I kept the Baggs preamp and mic as is and reinstalled the Fishman undersaddle pickup and ran it with the Baggs preamp just like the ribbon was. I felt I was then getting the best of both worlds because the Fishman undersadle is hotter with a more solid low end and the Baggs mic and pre I just love. So after about another year I again felt the Fishman undersaddle was just too harsh and I wanted to try something different. So I installed a K&K Sound Pure Western triple transducer under-the-bridgeplate p/u and ran it w/ the Baggs pre just like the other transducers. And let me tell you, I am very happy with this setup, even after 2-3 years. The K&K Sound p/u blows any transducer I've heard or had away as it is woody but with a solid low end and never harsh, and mixed with the very natural sounding Baggs mic is easy and sounds great. The Baggs pre can be internally mixed and ran mono with a regular 1/4" instrument cable or with your mic / transducer separately with a TRS 1/4" plug so you can process the signals separately externally. I run it mono out either to the board or to my Peavey Ecoustic amp which has a notch filter which greatly increases headroom before feedback. This rig gives me a very acoustic guitar sounding signal which is easily blended to taste and with good notch filtering can get very loud without feedback problems. An accurate sounding amplified acoustic guitar in a live setting has often been called the holy grail, meaning it is unattainable. This may be so, but I can get a loud mellow to very aggressive acoustic guitar sound with this rig. Therefore, for years now, I have considered my long and expensive holy grail quest over.

For which styles and positions is this pickup (un)suitable:

Comments: I am considering buying it again for another acoustic. I've been playing seriously for 15 years and regularly with solo or band situations for 10 years. I rated it as an 8 because I found the ribbon transducer to be weak and thin sounding.

Pickup features: ribbon transducer and mic with preamp
Impedence or other specs:

Model of guitar or bass: Gibson J-100
Position: all positions
Pickup being replaced: none
Other pickups on guitar:
Artists using this pickup:
You musical style(s): blues, rock, fusion
Reason for pickup change: needed to play live with this acoustic

Perceived output level: hot -- moreso on the mic than the ribbon transducer
Tone: Ribbon -- balanced, Mic -- a little bassy/boomy (depends on placement)
Sonic evaluation: I installed the Dual Source in my Gibson J-100, and have played it through a completely dry Roland studio monitor (to test), and my Fender Super Reverb. I had previously used a Fishman Rare Earth soundhole pickup and hated it. It was good at what it was designed for, but with an acoustic, YOU NEED TO HEAR THE WOOD! You need to be able to tap the body and hear it. I owned the Fishman for one day (to do a gig), and returned it. I did extensive research, and this Dual Source seemed to fit the bill. Just a pickup (or transducer) would be too dry, and just a mic would cause too much feedback. The Dual Source is perfect...
I installed it myself, because $100 for installation is a joke. Just remove the strap pin and enlarge the hole to 1/2". I also had to slightly enlarge the pre-existing hole under the saddle in order to slide the ribbon transducer in. No biggie. The time consuming part of the job is making sure you have all the components where you want them, and bundling the wires together (which is more aesthetics than anything else). I will say that the instructions were pretty terrible. They're written under the assumption (for the most part) that you're only buying the pre-amp, not the whole unit. 80% of the instructions were explaining how to solder and clip wires, and all kinds of stuff that was irrelevant. So I barely read them. The pictures pretty much tell you all you need to know. There was also not one single word about installing the ribbon transducer. I hope I have it in right-side-up. Strange.
Installing everything inside the guitar was pretty easy. It's all mounted on velcro which is then stuck to the inside with double-sided tape. This lets you easily 'un-velcro' the preamp and lift it out if need be. The remote control for the volume mounts in seconds with 2 phillips screws to the lip of the soundhole. HOWEVER -- they threw me a curve ball when it came to mounting the battery. They supply a clip which holds it in place, and you'd think it would be attached using the same tape/velcro system as the pre-amp, but NO! The instructions say to screw the attachment onto a block of wood (?) with the screws provided and glue (?) the whole contraption to a spot inside the guitar. OK, I found a block of wood and sized it down. I go to screw it on, and the screws they provided aren't even wood screws -- they're machine screws! I better be damn sure where I want to glue this whole mess, because there's no going back. OK, screw it (no pun intended) -- there has to be a better way. I took two small pieces of double sided mounting tape that I had (the foamy stuff that's about 2mm thick), put it on the back of the battery clip, and stuck it to the inside of the back of the guitar. It's non-permanent, easily accessible, and if the tape loses its 'stick' I can slap a new piece on in a second for next to no money. This needed to be mentioned, because it was very strange.
The instructions make the positioning of the mic to be some great deal. "A half inch in any direction makes a huge difference in your sound..." I don't know about this. For a flimsy little low-tech mic, how much difference could it make? Its only purpose is to pick up some of that acoustic mojo, not to capture the sound like a $2,000 stand-alone Neuman. Also, due to the size of the foam block (with double-sided tape) that it's imbedded in, there were only really two places I could put it -- in between bracing behind the low-E side of the bridge, or in between bracing behind the high-E side of the bridge. Since the ribbon transducer is more adept at capturing lows, and the mic is better suited for capturing highs, I put it behind the high-E side of the bridge. Sounds good to me.
After about an hour, I was able to plug in. Pure joy. No bugs, no glitches. I rolled off the mic volume to hear what

Comments: I would buy it again in a heart-beat. $165 is a FANTASTIC value.
I love everything about it. I hate nothing. "Hate" is such a strong word.
Like I said, I compared it to the Fishman Rare Earth soundhole pickup I briefly had (which I paid $150 for 2 years ago), and the Dual Source BLOWS IT AWAY! I had sworn off acoustic pickups, because I figured if you can't hear the wood, then what's the point? I am reborn.
This is all I could have hoped for. No, it's not a 100% accurate reproduction of the guitar's natural sound. What would be? Without a bevy of well-placed expensive mics in a controlled environment, you're not going to get that. It IS darn close, and what it does do is great. It reminds me of Jeff Buckley's sound on the Live In Chicago DVD when he plays his Guild acoustic on "So Real". Except it's actually better than that -- even more 'acoustic' sounding.

Pickup features: Active mic and trancducer
Impedence or other specs:

Model of guitar or bass: Martin D-15
Position: all positions
Pickup being replaced: some magnetic pickup system
Other pickups on guitar: none
Artists using this pickup: see the Baggs website
You musical style(s): all kinds
Reason for pickup change: Liike to try a active and heard so many positive reviews on this gear.

Perceived output level: Very sensitive and clean sound. probably no more preamp required.
Tone: It is controllable, so it is up to your taste. you can get whatever you want, almost.
Sonic evaluation: I installed myself (voided warranty) into my new Martin D-15, and connected to PA through LR baggs' Para DI. The Dual source itself is very hot, so usually I do not use Para DI. Very balanced and clean. Without Para DI, sometimes I got huge feedbaack (Oops).
But the generally it is most greatest active pickup for the sound, and it is also one of the most user-friendly made on-board system. You can select the mic or transducer volume independently to get the your favorite sound from your guitar. According to the manual, the battery life time is also great, > 250 hours. everything is hust great to me.

For which styles and positions is this pickup (un)suitable: Rock to Church music I play. Some fingering style when I am in mood.

Comments: The sound is too good to me, and it is joyful to adjust its sound to get better, I mean more closer, sound from my guitar. A littlew bit technical installation, but very satifying achivement! No minus point for the sound quality. I whish they provide better, higher quality of wires and contact plugs and jacks. I am happy to have it. Well, one bad thing: I called one luthier (one Baggs dealer recommended him) to install it and he asked $125.00 USD! Oh, Lord, I paid $200.00 for it and i have to pay 65% of the sale price to keep the manufacture warranty? Installation was not that hard. Just needed several right size of drill bits and some experiance. And it was just less than 1 hour job for me (the first time beginner). Well, I just saved $125.00 plus tax and lost the warranty. The Manufacture should provide reasonable install sources, and for this kind of easy installation process, they can warn users and some restrict comments can be applied. But they cannot still my warranty like this! It means the real price is the gear price and the installation which is about $100, pus all taxes. IT IS REALLY EXPENMSIVE GEAR! I just sacrificed my warranty and saved $125.00, and the sound is just great! Maybe I was lucky. Anyway because of this I cannot giove 10 or 9 for the finall rate. Because the total cost is too high to keep the warranty. If it was lost, stolen or broken, I would consider to buy it again. But can I get the warranty that time if I install it again? If not, well, I will try another gear next time! I am serious! It is not a cheap gear! The pickup price (~$400.00) is close to my guitar itself (<$600.00)!

Pickup features: Pickup/condenser mic system with onboard preamp
Impedence or other specs:

Model of guitar or bass: Installed in a Seagull S6+ folk
Position: all positions
Pickup being replaced: No pickup was installed in this Seagull. I installed the Dual Source myself.
Other pickups on guitar:
Artists using this pickup:
You musical style(s): Used for acoustic lead work in recording and live
Reason for pickup change: I wanted a plug-in setup so I wouldn't be limited in live situations to standing in front of a microphone.

Perceived output level: Good, solid output, and completely adjustable if more (or less) is needed.
Tone: When blended, I find this is a very, very good sound, especially for this guitar.
Sonic evaluation: I think the pickup alone doesn't sound particularly great. When blended with the microphone, however, it yields up a pretty natural sound with good definition that is highly useable. The mic adds both warmth and air which the pickup alone needs. I also like the fact that when it's run in Mono mode (where you blend the two yourself with the clip-on control), there is always a bit of the pickup signal in the path.
I have used this in live concerts through large PA systems, and in recording (into a Mackie 1604 to a VS-1680).

For which styles and positions is this pickup (un)suitable: acoustic leads with this setup, mainly.

Comments: I've played acoustic lead guitar for a number of singer-songwriters, notably Jack Hardy, for close to 20 years, both live and in the studio. When I decided to get a smaller body guitar just to play around with live, I settled on a nice little Seagull I happened on. But I hate being chained to a microphone live, so I decided I needed a pickup or pickup/microphone system. Luckily, I found one being cleared out of my local MARS Music store (before the bankruptcy) for about a third of the going retail price. I snapped it up - and this is what I think of it.
What I Like About The Dual Source:
* I really love the control being at my fingertips. It's incredibly nice, while on stage, to be able to quickly and easily change the volume or the blend. This is a fantastic feature. I can't say enough good things about being able to have such convenient control without a belt unit or foot switch or something.
* As stated above, I think the sound is very, very good. I haven't had feedback problems with it, but if I did, I'd just roll back the blend until they ceased. I love the way this setup sounds.
What I Don't Like About The Dual Source:
* The adhesives used on the components. The adhesive on the back of the microphone regularly comes loose - to get around it, I used on of the stays they include to keep the wires straight as a sort-of security holder. I'm going to have to superglue the velcro fastener to the battery holder. Every time I move the guitar, the battery falls out. The velcro itself sticks together fine - it's the adhesive on the back of the velcro that refuses to stay on the holder. This is incredibly annoying, because I have to detension the
strings and reach my arm in there before every gig. An enormous pain in the ***.
* It may just be me, but I have trouble putting certain 1/4" cables in the jack. Monster Cables, for example, have to be almost forced in. I've had better success with a Fender cable. This probably has more to do with Monster and less to do with the Baggs unit.
What You Should Know About The Dual Source:
* Be prepared to spend a little time playing with the settings (particularly the low rolloff). That said, though, this unit required minimal tweaking to get a very good sound. Pretty much off the dime it sounded great.
* The installation instructions are fantastic, if you decide to install it yourself.
* All of the documentation for this product is thorough, complete, informative, well-written, and easy to understand. Bravo!
What You Should Know About Installing The Dual Source Yourself:
* Be aware that if you install it yourself, you do so at your own risk.
* Despite the above, it's not terribly hard to install, and the instructions, as mentioned above, are excellent. I had never done an installation like this myself - I figured the Seagull wasn't that expensive, so if I completely destroyed it, I'd save my pennies and buy a new one. As it turned out, however, following the instructions and excercising care allowed a novice like me to get it right pretty much the first time.
* Positioning the microphone inside the guitar, however, is an excruciating experience. Because it's not on a gooseneck or clip - the mic is in a block of foam that has an adhesive back, which you stick onto the spot you like - you position it where you think it should go, tension the strings, try it out, detension the strings, and move it around to another spot - then repeat until you're happy. I finally just picked a spot and stuck it there. I guess I got lucky. ;)
Overall Impressions:
I also have a '74 Martin D-35, and after I got these results with the Dual Source in the Seagull, I strongly considered picking one up for the Martin - until I got a K&K Trinity System for $175 on eBay. At the same time, however, after I had installed the Trinity system in the Martin and brought it to a concert I was playing, I ended up using the Seagull with the Dual Source. The Trinity setup needs a boatload of t

Pickup features: active preamp mic blender
Impedence or other specs:

Model of guitar or bass: goodall mahogany/adirondack grand concert cutaway
Position: neck
Pickup being replaced:
Other pickups on guitar:
Artists using this pickup:
You musical style(s): all styles
Reason for pickup change: looking for a pickup that will really do justice to a great guitar

Perceived output level: subtle to hot depending on blend
Tone: very balanced and natural
Sonic evaluation: goodall mgcc with a ta100 trace elliot acoustic amp

For which styles and positions is this pickup (un)suitable: all styles but alot of agressive flatpicking and strumming

Comments:

Pickup features: see the L.R. Baggs website as I can't remember all of them.
Impedence or other specs:

Model of guitar or bass: Taylor 355
Position: all positions
Pickup being replaced: none
Other pickups on guitar: none
Artists using this pickup: not sure, I think L.R. Baggs' website lists some artists who use their gear.
You musical style(s): I use it mainly to lead worship with at church. I also use it for doing a little home recording.
Reason for pickup change:

Perceived output level:
Tone: It sounds like a louder acoustic guitar, not just an electrified acoustic. It sounds awesome through the sound system at church. It requires no kind of additional preamps or added effects to get a killer sound. Just some very minor adjustments with the EQ on the mixing board and it sounds killer. I think it is probably the best sounding amplified acoustic guitar that I have heard from our church.
Sonic evaluation:
For which styles and positions is this pickup (un)suitable: Leading worship is just about the only time I have a need to amplify this guitar.

Comments: I think it was not installed totally correct. I need to take it back in because the sound output for the two treble E strings is a little lower than the rest of the srings. It's not really a problem for strumming but it can be a bit bothersome when trying to do some light finger picking. I think the problem is not the pickup, but the installation. The pickup system gave me the exact sound I was looking for. I payed a lot for the guitar and I wanted to be able to get it's awesome sound out to the rest of the people. This pickup system did it. When I buy my next Taylor I will have this pickup sysytem installed.

Pickup features: Ribbon Transducer, internal microphone, preamp, Remote Control
Impedence or other specs: 1200 Ohm, 37Hz lo cut filter, 9v battery, approx 250 hr. battery life, microphone phase, lo/hi gain transducer, and mono/stereo switches.

Model of guitar or bass: Larrivee C-09
Position: bridge
Pickup being replaced: None
Other pickups on guitar: None
Artists using this pickup: David Wilcox
You musical style(s): Jazz, Rock, Praise, Folk, Fingerstyle
Reason for pickup change: Wanted an onboard system that allowed more of the sound of the guitar to come through than just the "standard" piezo, or ewven magnetic soundhole pickup.

Perceived output level: Slightly hotter than the Fishman Matrix 1 in mono mode, stereo mode seems to give an even greater volume boost.
Tone: R.T. - very warm tone, much more "high bass/lo-mid" rich than other undersaddle pickups I've heard. Still has that crisp top end and can get harsh when played too hard. . . Microphone: the microphone was placed in a position that does let the sound ofthe guitar come through, but it also seems to zero in on a mid range tone in the guitar that makes for a very "honky" tone in the 600Hz range from the microphone.
Sonic evaluation: As mentioned above, the guitar is a Larrivee C-09. I've run it through a Fander Acoustasonic Jr. and have gotten a good tone. In sending the signal to a PA, I've run into some problems. I usually run my acoustics through a Boss AD-5 preamp (reviewed before). For the Matrix 1 and the Rare Earth Humbucker equipped guitars, this works fine and the resonance adds some warmth and character to the tone. When not using the Ad-5, I might use a Fishman Pro-EQ.
The Dual Source system proved problematic. As I mentioned before, the microphone accentuates a midrange "honk" that is part of the guitar's characteristic tone. When trying to dial it out, I discovered that both the AD-5, and the Pro-EQ are unable to address that frequency. The midrange controls cover too wide a frequency range. Also, the resonance and mic placement controls on the AD-5 just cause feedback in the low mids and the high end.
The solution was to separate the microphone signal from the Ribbon Transducer and eq them seperately (Pro-EQ for the piezo, ART Tube EQ for the mic, and both blended into the AD-5). Once done, I was able to get a very realistic representation of my guitar's natural tone, and without feedback problems, and this in a live situation with a full band. It did take a bit of getting used to not having that heavy, bright, piezo high end, but the sound engineer loved the tone coming through the house. Also, even with the microphone, I didn't have a feedback problem all night, and the other guitarist, with piezo and onboard preamp was continuously on the edge, and we were both at a similar volume level. That opened my eyes. . .
All that being said, while none of the Fishman systems did it for e, the Dual Source system seemed to have the potential to give something richer, and I think it delivers.

For which styles and positions is this pickup (un)suitable: This p/u is a good match for fingerstyle, folk, jazz, and even worship services. Maybe even Bluegrass if you could convince the guitarist to give up the external microphone (but why would they?)For hard, driving rock, etc, against a full band, the tone will get lost in the mix. It tends more towards "subtle" rather than "muscular."

Comments: I compared the Dual Source System against the Fishman Blender systems, and this one won hands down. A big part of that was the tone from the Ribbon Transducer. While not the magicalsolution to tone problems, it's great warmth gives a strong base for the the microphone to enhance.
Been playing about 27 years now, I have a Taylor C612(with Fishman/Taylor Matrix 1) and a Martin 0001 (with the Rare Earth Humbucker soundhole p/u), both reviewed previously.
As to having that "holy grail" tone, no, this doesn't have that. You're still not going to beat great microphones and good placement, but with a bit of work, and maybe a bit of outboard gear, you might be able to get something that sounds very much like your guitar, but only louder, and that's just about the best I could ask for.
As to replacement if this one breaks, I'm already thinking of having one installed in my Martin. I'll take one off just because it can't beat microphones and for the effort needed to reach that potential great sound the Dual Source System promises.