M-Audio Black Box Reloaded (v.2.3.1)

Very Simple, There really is only ONE VERSION. You either buy the Re-Loaded verion or download it from the M-Audio websight. The BOX is the SAME.

I Figured this out with NO Manual or instructions from anyone? So how hard is it to use? Come-On now.

There are a LOT of options with this BOX and simply put, some AMAZING Tones. Man the tihings you could do with this with a ABY switch in your live signal path are endless.

Plus it has a Drum Machine built and a Looper? So for a practice unit or even live, thats a heck of a PLUS!

Keep the Output Level backed off a bit do do away with the Digital Tone. Use you Amp Volume. No problems with Tone what-so-ever. Standing alone this unit sounds good. Infromt of an amp its one of the better units I've heard. And I've heard them all. These and the Vox for my money are the better Tones.

NO problems. I bought this used with no manual. Works great no issues. Take care of it and it will be fine.

Put it this way, its a durable as any other unit I've seen out here. And more durable than most!

Don't know, never used them?

For a practice tool, or to add some great unusual effects to your signal vi a ABY switch? This box is very hard to beat. I'm getting great Tones in front of my Fender Twin Reverb? As a Stand alone unit? Hey a Drum pattern that has a Tempo adjustment and a Looper? Thats about the best practice situation i could think of? Gee yu could be a One Man Band with this puppy!

Easy to use. Important to keep the input level low or you get that digital distortion.

I use a Carlo Robelli Hollow body and a Fender Vibrolux reverb amp. This is not what you would use for a standalone muli-effect processor. It has great sounds, however, I run mine through a loop switcher and it works well to just insert some nice unique sounds into your music. I play mostly original music so im not trying to sound like someone else. When I switch over to the black box it always gets everyone attention. The next question is usually can you do something with that sound in the song? See there is nothing out there quite like this so dont try to make it a POD or Digitech (which I also have). This should be used to give YOU a unique voice. The sounds in the Black box are simlpy amazing. Everytime I play with it I find somethig new. It is a wonderful creative tool. So leave the distortion to the other pedals and use it for something different. If you approach it this way you will discover it to be pricless. Music is about being creative and the black box gives me fresh inspiration every time I turn it on. Have Fun!

I have had no problems. I though I was buying the reloaded version but when I got to the store it was not. So I downloaded the upgrade and it works well.

Have not need them. Hope not to.

I play original music Gospel, Jazz, Rock, Fusion, Soul. This Pedal has something for everything. You have to keep an open mind. Ive been playin for 40+ years. If stolen I would surely run out a get another! The sound are fantastic. It would be nice if it had a better foot controller. I use two m audio sustain pedals to change patches. But it works for me because I keep it in a footswitchable loop.Get one and have fun!

I have the original Black Box and then Reloaded it with the update. It's easy to use...twirl some knobs which do not have end points. So you twist until the digits stop changing on the screen. The screens change depending on what you are working with. The gain volume treb and bass for an amp are on one screen, for midrange you have to press another pair of buttons and hop on one foot for exactally 4 seconds, then spin clockwise 22 revolutions and you can adjust the midrange, but then you have to change back to tweek the bass again. That was the trade off for the increase in amps and tweeks and effects etc. I bought my first Black Box in 2005 and the reloaded unit is a large improvement.But it just isn't plug and play.

Good sound is subjective. I tried using this with M-Audio BX5a powered near field monitors plugged into the black box. This was a good way to start as I could spend time tweeking but it was hard to get the depth of the sound. I then used it with a marshall 8008 power amp with 2 2x12 avitar cabs with JBL e120's. I was able to get some great sounds on the clean side. The Deluxe was probably the best. But the reverb crapped up the sound. It was like adding a tin can to the sound. There are a bunch of effect that are really cool to play with once. But I can't think of any recorded material that ever used some of this stuff.

I said above that I bought my first one in 2005. I have had 4 of these. Each one died for no reason. When I plugged the guitar in, the only sound I could get was muffled drums. No guitar just drums and you could not really hear them. I checked the book, then called M=Audio. I sent it to them and got a new one back. Pretty fast considering. Then I got my third one almost 1 year later. Same symptom no audio out but no faint drums either. Just a light for the microphone twitching in rhythm to its self. The last one died from lack of use. I had not used it for about 4 months. I took it out of the box, hooked it up and....no sound but the drums made some faint noise. Great.

These folks are good. They responded each time with what ever they could do. This time I'm not calling that the machine died. I just know that it's not something that I am willing to use again. I would put it in the ground but the plastic will be there in 5000 years. I think that someone will dig it up and that **** light will still be twitching.

Just don't buy this. Keep thinking about the price, and all the stuff the give you. Then you know it must be given away for a reason. Please get a ToneLab, or a Line6 or something else but M-Audio's Black Box is not worth your time.

Fairy simple to use. Partially because there is not a whole lot you can adjust with the amp patches. English section of the manual is only 14 pages. Manual says the product contains lead and you should wash your hands after handling haha.

I can get a few decent tones from this. Good cleans, decent tweed / texas type sound. Decent Marshall sound. I did not like the modern recto type sounds, there was somethine funny going on with the EQ that made it sound thin, and you don't have a lot of control over the tone on this unit. Just bass mid and treble (mid is a recent addition - you can tell they weren't very interested in EQ flexibility when they made this thing).

I run this into a keyboard amp or computer.

No problems.

No experience.

I play rock, country, fusion, metal. Playing for 25 years. Own Vamp2, Tonleab, MagicStomp (it rocks !), Vetta, RoadKing, F-50. I would not replace it.

This unit is not for people like me who like to do lot of adjusting to their tone. The unit just isn't flexible, not enough EQ options, can't disable cab sims. The amp sims were not a high priority on this unit.

This unit is for people who don't want to do a lot of tweaking of their sound, who are into beat-syncd modulation, having a drum machine, and a recording interface for their computer. This is where the value of this unit is. I have a high opinion of Roger Linn, but this unit isn't for me.

This unit has as steep a learning curve as any appliance I've used in the last decade. Simple use of the presets can produce SOME nice sounds but patience can be & is rewarded with better tone. Some presets work better than others dependant on your guitar & amp.

Many have reported better sound thru use of full-range monitors rather than mono guitar-specific amp output. I like it much better in stereo also this way.
My guitar amp (Roland Cube 30) sounds . . . ok but when cranked thru my studio monitors is when this box sounds fattest

Having used it for two weeks now, have gotta lot to learn but, so far . . .

Really natural sounding amp models :
the twin reverb, the roland jazz, the plexi all sound great for playing the changes and underneath. Back in the day, I hada good twin & it certainly sounds like my memory

killer lead tones so far from the buddha, the extacy, the solden and the plexi, in no particular order

Effects are no big shakes unless you really like tremelo/LFO effects pulsing with the beat supplied from your host sequencer thru the usb then : look out, baby

Simple to use noise gate, simple to use compressor, additional delay effects with echo, chorusing & so forth - I gotta lot to learn but think that the "pulse" thing is gonna be both addictive and a regular part of my sound from here on out.


I also notice a sensitivity to pickup mix. On my Parker, some amp models sound better with the single-coils tapped, some cry out for a fat 'bucker wailing.

Would NOT use it for a gig but it does look strong enough to hold up in my studio(it's natural home) for, hopefully many years. Fingers crossed

Dunno . . .

I think if one thinks outside the box with regard to amplification of the guitar, you might like to try this alternative. I'll check back in 2008 with a further review but for now, keep on rockin' in the free world !

Pretty easy given the user unfriendly (especially their 'shift' fix) arrangement of buttons and knobs.

User patches for the most part are useless, would be nice to be able to overwrite them with user tweaked patches.

Horrible Horrible Horrible. Unusable due to the nasty digital distorted 'artifacts' that attach them self to certain effects and combinations of amp/effect, (unless mine was faulty) I didn't bother to keep it long enough to find out. Looks like 'David' had a similar problem as he wrote in his review:

"The distortion modeling in the BB has a very serious flaw, at least on my box: Low and mid-register notes are fine, but bending high notes (>14 fret) or harmonics (squeals) produces a sort of multi-voiced 'swishing' background noise that sounds something like AM-interference if you bend the note slowly. On many of the patches it's pretty much drowned out by the reverb, but if you turn all the effects off it sounds like someone is tuning his shortwave radio in time with your bend. This sucks, sucks, sucks."

I agree and more.... I think that they have a chip problem with this unit or very unstable software issues / bugs.

I wouldn't depend on anything M Audio makes... they are getting pretty close to Behringer in the reliability area IMHO. I have had a few of their devices that have not stood up well in the field (Ozone, Oxygen 61).

They sent me a free power adapter once, that was nice. Now they just pat themselves on the back for all the awards that they have won from magazines that they pay to advertise in and keep churning out junk.

Don't bother trying to use this as a performance tool. Roger Linn should be ashamed of the association.

Very easy to get up and go. the shift settings are a pain, but once to do them a few times it comes easy. I use this for very pro recordings...

I am in the middle of my bands 3rd. CD, and it is a very hi end recording. The m-box is being used along with many other LIVE amps..
I think the cleans sound very good, but you have to adjust them. take the reverbs off or way down, use the EQ, and the gain setting should be low. The crunch setting are just OK, great for adding a track to thicken the live track. The lead tones on the Bogner exctasy are fantastic as well as some of the Marshalls. The delay is awesome as well as the chorus 1 & 2. the rest of the effects are all just noise to me. I have used the drum settings on some fill stuff and most on pre production stuff..
I have used POD's since the day they came out, and even the VOX tone lab stuff...just tweak this black box, and it kills all those others. Very real tones here, even the artifacts sound like a live mic'ed amp..watch the EQ & gains..they can sound fake, just tweek and you will find the sweet spots..then save them.

dont know yet....but if it lasts through one CD, it was worth the money..

been great on other M audio stuff...

I have used POD's , digitech genesis, Vox tone labs, and even Koch direct box stuff...this kills all of them..it sounds more like a real amp them anything out there..If you can use it with live mic'ing..it works wonders. It will be a main stay in my studio from here on out. Just the bogner exctasy setting is worth the price paid for it.

I've been using this extensively in several settings (amateur recording, band, personal practice) for about a month now. I feel I've seen where it can go and where it can't at this point so I'm posting my review.

GENERAL FUNCTIONALITY
The basic controls are very intuitive, i.e. just like the front of an amp. Also, pushing the 'delay' button changes the knobs into parameter knobs for delay, ditto for the 'fx' button. Very easy.

The added 'shift' functions are a little less intuitive as you have to "select" a value knob first, which basically means twisting it until the parameter name blinks, then double-click the relevant button to activate the shift function. But hey, they had to add a ton of new functions without having the option of changing the hardware and they did well for that. The buttons are even labeled with their shift-functions.

MANUAL
The pdf-manual is okay to get you into how the box works, but I find it seriously lacks depth in some of the more important points of the BB, namely the rhythm and rhythm-to-effect aspect. There are a hundred different drumbeats but they are not even listed in the manual. You have to scroll through them on the screen to just learn their names. Same goes for the very cool beat-activated effects. The complicated 20-each "Filter-Sequence" and "Tremolo-Sequence" effects are simply listed as that. Some of them are so intricate though it's not entirely clear what they are doing, not to mention it might have been helpful to have some sort of reference. Since they are simply named e.g. "Filseq" 1 throught 20 you have to listen to them every time you're looking for something in particular. Manageable but certainly not very efficient and not user friendly.

COMPUTER SOFTWARE (BB-specific)
The computer software is rudimentary. It allows you to load a patch or save one to a file and adjust a few settings regarding how the BB interacts with your computer. It's not an actual interface or anything, more like an extension to the windows control panel. In its simplicity it's obviously user friendly.

DRUMBEATS
There are 100 drumbeats or various colors, most are actually very good, IMO. On the downside, the drumbeats are grouped rather strangely: For example, IIRC there's "metal" 1 & 2 in slot 1 & 2, then rock 1 & 2 in slots 3 & 4. Then there are two or three beats called "Lo-fi" which are pretty electronic-music oriented, then there are a few traditional beats again and so on. They probably wanted everybody trying the thing out to find a beat they liked within the first few seconds, which makes sense from a marketing perspective, but once you're actively using the BlackBox, with 100 beats to chose from, this lack of sytem in the "beat filing order" (for lack of a better name) makes it hard to actually find the beat you want. IRRC the beats "Rock" 3 and 4 are filed up in the mid-90s, which is at the completely other end of the library and several long seconds of scrolling away! If I'm looking for a rock beat, I may want to have them all grouped together, so I can compare them, no? Not here. There's no scroll wrapping either, i.e. it goes to "99" and then stops. If you want to go to #4 from #94 the only way is down. All in all I find this whole system not user-friendly at all. This is even even more so if you consider that you can program a footswitch to scroll through the beats: Why bother if you need to be able to fine tune up and down when you finally get there because you've been standing on the switch for five seconds?

FOOTSWITCHES, EXP-PEDAL
Footswitches are very easy to program, they can be programmed to be any of the buttons on the BB, most importantly tap-tempo. One negative point is that the switches have to be plugged in before you turn the BB on and you shouldn't unplug them while the machine is running or it will register as a button press. This is attenuated by the fact that the BB doesn't have a power switch so you're pulling the plug in and out when something like

My signal chain is:
Brian Moore 7.1 ->Guyatone Comp-> WD7 Wah-> MT2-> Magicstomp-> TS9-> Boss Super Shifter-> BlackBox.

EFFECTS
The effects are okay, I guess. Not fantastic but not noticeably bad. You can set all the basic parameters to what you like (time, depth, level etc.) but there's no deep editing and only five set reverb times. Some of the "sequence"-effects are very cool though and make up for the other shortcomings in the effects department. If you want great delay you seriously took the wrong path getting a compact amp modeller. You can synchronize the effects with a midi clock besides the usual tap-tempo, which is very cool when you're recording something and change the song tempo

SOUND
Well, heres the thing: Initially I was thrilled by the patches. The BB is quiet on its own. Distortions sounded rich and fat, the Bogner and Soldano models are fantastic (I mean the way they sound. I can't compare them to the real thing). There is one obvious caveat though: IMO this box is geared very much towards rock and metal. There are only two factory presets for clean, the Bassman and the Jazz Chorus, most of the other models distrort even on the lowest gain settings and even if some can be tweaked to give a pretty good clean (especially IMO the VOX models) sound, that's just obviously not what they had in mind. The distorted sounds are fantastic for saturated rhythm sounds though, fat, heavy and (mostly) clear and defined, even on a 7-string guitar. So:

CLEAN SOUNDS: 6
CRUNCH SOUNDS: 7
DISTORTED RHYTHM: 8

but:
LEAD SOUNDS: 2

The distortion modeling in the BB has a very serious flaw, at least on my box: Low and mid-register notes are fine, but bending high notes (>14 fret) or harmonics (squeals) produces a sort of multi-voiced 'swishing' background noise that sounds something like AM-interference if you bend the note slowly. On many of the patches it's pretty much drowned out by the reverb, but if you turn all the effects off it sounds like someone is tuning his shortwave radio in time with your bend. This sucks, sucks, sucks.

Turn down the gain (way down!) and it goes away, so it is the distortion modeling. It seems to be that part of the signal processing that makes the rhythm sounds sound so fat and rich. Something like a harmonic enhancement of the signal that, when stretched out by a bend and thinned down by a single high note sounds like, as I said, AM-interference.

So basically I can't (or don't want to) use the BB's sounds for lead and I can't use it for rhythm where I'm doing very many bent high notes or harmonic squeals, unless there's a lot going on in the background. My remedy was to set a clean sound that sounded good with my stop boxes (especially the Magicstomp) and now I use it as a backend for the rest of my rig for practicing and for HD recording. It sounds good this way as well, but more like the rest of my rig and it's certainly louder this way. And it kind of neuters the whole amp modeling idea if you're bringing most of your sound in with another box. But it works and it's still quiet enough to be workable and heck, what are the alternatives? I don't have room to mic my amp.

So far so good. I occasionally get a 'mute' patch when changing patches, i.e. I scroll up to the next patch, it displays all right but the sound is not there. Scrolling up or down and back again solves the problem though. Nothing major and I can't reproduce it at will, just something that happened a few times. Don't perform with it. Set it and leave it alone.

Well, they did offer a firmware update free of charge, which is pretty good for those that bought the old one. I haven't dealt with them though. I'll be contacting them on this distortion issue though, see what happens.

STYLES
I play mainly rock but listen to a lot of styles from hip hop to metal. Mainly Jazz, Prog rock and 'modern' Country though. I was initially let down after discovering the sound issues I described with this box, but I've come to terms with my disappointment. Instead of providing an alternative to the hassles of my amp in band practices I'm now into HD-recording. Fair enough.

As I mentioned this box is pretty rock oriented. There are also only a couple of jazz drumbeats in the 100 beats overall, and they're all pretty driven and 'loud'. I'm sure you could tweak a usable sound for just about anything out of this box though. Since it's amp model based & doesn't have any deep editing.

I really wish the filter and tremolo sequences were editable and you could load your own drumbeats, that would seriously enhance what I consider an area of high potential and uniqueness with this unit. Until then though, the beat portion is just not much of a tie-in with your recording and pretty much just a glorified metronome. Also, as it stands with the effect sequences you're stuck playing with someone else's ideas and that gets old fast - if it inspires you at all: Many of the sequences are moronically simple and hence not very interesting, even if you syncopate them with dotted 8th-note delay and such. The "arpeggiator" is worthless IMO, because it arpeggiates a preset sequence from a predefined pitch (default is E, transpose in semitones from there), and that pitch has nothing to do with the pitch you are playing at. Like having your crazy cousin playing keyboards in the background. That may be something that impressed people in the 90s, but we're well beyond that today.


I think to judge the overall value of this thing you need to get a clear picture of what it is and what it isn't. It's not, contrary to what M-Audio claims, a performance tool. This is geared toward PC-recording and practicing. It's unsuited for performing for various reasons, most notably a pause between patch changes, the somewhat buggy patch changing itself (i.e. the sometimes mute patches) and the lack of fully assignable parameter controls, i.e. you can only have two footswitches, so e.g. if you need tap-tempo anyway, you only have one footswitch left for controlling everything else, so you have to decide between patch up, down, delay toggle, effects toggle, drumbeat start/stop etc. That's just not enough to perform with. Also, the expression pedal is not assignable to all values you may want, e.g. amp gain and AFAIK you can't set the pedal travel range, which is essential for the wah patches. All that makes it just not workable in a performing environment.

For recording however I find it a very easy-to-use interface to get things from your guitar through your other stompboxes into your computer.


The main value driver in this thing for me other than the AD/DA computer-interface is the bundled Ableton Live Lite software. I've found Live Lite to be an extremely versatile, inspiring and easy to use application that just opens up a whole world of recording to the (relatively) uninitiated like myself without requiring any other expensive hardware at all. Ableton Live evolved from a DJ application so it's very loop and beat oriented, something that works perfectly with the very beat oriented black box. This aspect should be expanded, as I already mentioned, by including user editable effects sequences and drum loops, but being able to automatically sync your delay times with the song tempo is definitely cool.

If it were stolen or lost I'd probably replace it with a more powerful multieffects pedal (BOSS or ZOOM or Line6) with an USB out and use that with Ableton Live.

Despite what I consithe BB's shortcomings I give it a relatively high overall rating because it comes bundled with Ableton Live Lite (the included v4 is upgradeable to Live Lite v6!) and hence offers you a fully functional 24bit recording package (including software) at a relativ

Not as easy to use as a Vox tone lab, but much better sounds.
40 amp models and 121 effects, plus drums & killer delays..cant beat it for the price.
the manual is OK, you need to down load the PDF from the site..

Its like any other recording amp/effects factory..you get some good & some bad samples..The Bogner Ectasy and the delay quality is worth the units price alone..the Fenders are very cool, the Vox is good and the Marshall's sound very cool. The Matchless is also a fave..but there are alot of crapola amp sounds and alot of nonsence effects that only a retard would have any use for. Like I said the Bogner can give you a slamming lead tone right out of the box...Tweeking the revebs & mids & compression is all in shift modes that are a pain in the ass..I wish they would make a REAL LIFE unit that has the mids & reverb & compression all on the front panel in real time knobs, and dump all the effect crap other then reverb, delay, and chorus...The Bogner & delay is a 10..the rest of the box a 7..so I will give it a solid 8

It feels solid, but it allready jumps around abit on some settings..I bet its toast in a year of so...JUST LIKE ALL THE REST.

NEVER

I have done over 20 CD's with the POD's..Genesis..Vox Tone Labs..Boss VG8's..Korg..and now this...It does do some amps better then mic'ing live amps..but the rest are just not that good..

Very easy and intuitive, if you cant work this ---- give up. Haven't used the manual yet.

Reloaded version.

I cannot complain about the sound quality as I cannot really tell any difference between this output and my audiophile 4/96 or the motu 2408.

This unit does come with an incredibly fast ASIO driver that gives me 8 ms latency - guitar is instant. I moniter on the out board side not the input and am more than happy with the latency. I have steered away from my guitar recording due too latency but not anymore.
I also use it in bypass mode and use Native Instruments Guitar Rig, again 8 ms latency - this is on IBM thinkpad Centrino 1.8 ghz.

I also use it with Nuendo to directly record, I can open NI Guitar rig in that on a send or an insert and moniter in realtime ( 8 ms )

No problems and I run this for hours at a time just jamming. No crackles, no drop outs etc

Not needed

I paid ??80 for this and this now lets process my guitar and hear the output at 8 m/s latency - this could be very promising, coupled with NI Guitar Rig which has around 400 + presets ?????

I chose this over the Line stuff as I wanted drums / jammer mobile tool I can use at friends or when away.

With a pc and sequencer there no limit - only your own creativity. My laptop spec is :- IBM Think Pad Lenovo T43

P M 750(1.8GHz), 512MB RAM, 120GB 5400rpm HD, 14.1in 1024x768 LCD, 64MB ATI Radeon X300, CDRW/DVD, Intel 802.11bg wireless, Bluetooth/Modem, 1Gb Ethernet, UltraNav, Secure chip, 6c Li-Ion batt, WinXP Pro

This is new but no audio processing laptop for music ! it is my office tool for work but it cuts it so well for this black box it is now my permanent guitar studio consisting of Black Box / Nuendo / Strat / hifi.

In a nutshell it lets me in / out / thru to my sequencer with no fuss or delay, this lets me concentrate on making music. I cant get my latency this low with my 2408 nor my audiophile 24/96.