Native Instruments Guitar Rig VST PC

I felt I ought to post in defense of Guitar Rig because I suspect that a lot of the negative reviews are based either on demo versions and/ or less than ideal set ups. Not that GR is without fault, there is room for improvement, but much of what I read here sounds a little confused. I've been playing for 25 years, I've been through a couple of very nice tube amps, and every sort of modeling hardware and software you can think of. I am an amateur recording engineer and performer. My own music is best described as progressive rock, and I'm mainly a Windows/Intel guy. I've used GR on many computers now, through several sets of monitors and headphones. I spent A LONG TIME trying to decide whether to buy Guitar Rig, because I agree that the price is a bit steep, especially in light of the small number of amps modeled. But in the process of making up my mind, I think I developed a very well-informed opinion.

It couldn't be much easier. Drag what you want where you want it. There are a few features that aren't immediately crystal clear. The split feature can be difficult to apply to complex patches. I wish NI would implement come sort of select/copy/paste scheme similar to their own Reaktor workflow. I wish the tapedecks were a little more intuitive (but I suspect that some who complained were using demos, and here, they are disabled.) It is also possible to lose track of which modules are getting overloaded, and get into some weird compression/distortion problems (the "oscillation" issue mentioned by one reviewer) but this is also true of real hardware rigs of similar complexity.

Overall, the user interface is the best I've seen, and it's refreshing that the editor *is* the modeler, versus the MIDI to hardware nightmares you get into with PODs etc.

As for the foot controller - I balked at being forced to by hardware from a software company too, but now that I own it, I'm glad I do. It's a nice happy medium between a simple footswitch and a huge floorboard - just barely sufficient for performance, runs on battery if necessary, and eliminates a lot of cable clutter. Fits in a laptop bag. Cool by me.

The first thing to consider is that software algorithms, like hardware designs, just sound *different* from one another. Better and worse is an argument I don't waste much time with. I presently own GR, a Line 6 Flextone, a POD Pro, and a Vetta. I spend a lot of time trying to get a tone from one into a preset of another in time for a gig or whatever. What I've learned is that each of these devices, even the virtual ones, have their own distinct voice(s).

In comparison with the Line 6 products, GR does tend to lack a little bit of body in the mids. L6 sounds very warm and punchy. GR by contrast is detailed and hyped. Its biggest strength IMO lies in the cabinet/mic section, where arrays of mics can be positioned to very good effect. (Whoever complained that presets included too many cabs has missed the point - an additional "cabinet" is often added to simulate another mic on the same cab.) Its weakness is in lack of variety. For a "modeler" there just aren't enough models. After much tweaking, I've found that I can get almost anything I need by driving and EQ'ing the Gratifier properly, but I miss the fun of hearing what some amp I can never afford sounds like. Its more like using a single effect than a proper modeler.

*BUT* I disagree that GR falls short in terms of sound quality. The tones I've arrived at, finally, are just beautiful. Uber-gain patches can get noisy (and the noise gate is indeed lacking) but I almost always find that I can back off the gain and still get what I need with an acceptable noise floor.

Bottom line, GR delivers the goods, and if you don't like the presets (I don't either), don't use 'em. Hell, delete them! If you're discerning enough to hear what's wrong, you should have the ears to program something better. I give sound a 10 - FOR WHAT IT IS - a native plugin simulating an amp. This is not meant to imply that it sounds as good as a "10" tube amp. It just means that NI hit home with this one.

I give GR a 9. "Was it worth the price tag?" This is a loaded question. $450 is not the same money to different people. When I bought it I was able to afford it, even though I thought content was a little lacking compared to $400 worth of a PODxt for instance. I needed the elegance of an all-software solution, and realistically, this is the only game in town. I've tried Green Machine, Amp Legends, Revalver, etc, and none of them came close to doing the job for me. (Simulanalog's work is really awesome - download it now! - but it was an academic effort and they just didn't model a wide enough variety of devices.) I love the sound, I love having it available whenever a PC is handy, I love the ease of reamping, I love being able to set up 2 signal paths (guitar and bass combos anyone?) with one instance... I could go on an on. It's not a CPU hog by any stretch when you consider what it does (there's no real call for running 12 instances of it as one reviewer mentions - render, dude!) It's never crashed on me.

A very important point is this - I expect NI to support this program with additional content. They've already begun, and support has leaked word that more amp models are on the way. I don't think they're blowing smoke because, let's face it, if they don't add content, Line 6 or IK or somebody will eat them alive in sales.

For now it does what I paid for - very well - and in the future it can only get better.

Been working in home studio for more than 10 years, mostly with computer based setup. I used the plugin on tracks recorded with Yamaha Pacifica 812w guitar.

First the guitar rig seemed complicated, but after a while it was pretty easy to use. However!!! as the models are not accurate, it is impossible to get the right sound associated with the models used.

And, why don't the guitar rig plugin creators take advantage of the modular nature of vst plugins: why do they put all the virtual stompboxes, amps and cabinets inside the same plugin module?! It would be more usable and versatile if all pedals, all amp models and all cabinets would be separate vst plugins so you could chain them in whatever way you wish. You could even use a amp model from one manufacturer and cabinet model from other!

Bad. Really bad. Buzzing with no dynamics and clarity. The models do not represent their real life counterparts.

EVERYONE GET THE FREE SIMULANALOG GUITAR SUITE PLUGIN FROM WWW.SIMULANALOG.ORG. It has much fewer amps (only jcm900 and twin reverb + several stompboxes) but at least the models are very ,very usable! And it's FREE! (btw, I don't work for simulanalog:)

Nothing beats Pod XT so far.

Luckily I didn't buy the product, but tested it in friend's place when recording a promo for a rock band. It was stable, quite nice looking product, but sounded horrible.

I have previously posted in this thread.....

Since I have purhcased the GR (#350 UK) and it has operated flawlessly for me, I have only used it for studio work and not tried to use it live. I would be very cautious about doing this, but that is because of Windows and the fragile nature of PC's, not GR....

Anyway the reason for the post is this.....


Many people are complaining about both crashes and being forced to purchase the Kontrol Rig with the software as midi ones are better.

Rig Kontrol -
OK agreed there are units that are more solidly built than Rig Kontrol, with more controllers available on them.........BUT......

The Rig Kontrol uses an audio signal for the control and not MIDI messages.....This means one very important thing that no-one has mentioned here.
The audio signal does not suffer the same aliasing (stepping) problems when sweeping controls (e.g. WAH) like you get with MIDI.
MIDI has a set number of steps that the controller can send out (either 0-127 or 0-65335 depending on the type of midi controller) Ask anyone with a cheap Midi control surface who has tried to do accurate EQ and pannning.

The audio method adopted by NI still suffers some aliasing (we are talking digital audio afterall) but it is greatly reduced ( I have yet to notice its effects). The aliasing or stepping will be governed by your audio capture settings. The higher the sampling rate and/or bit depth, the less it will be apparent.

Somebody requested in this thread that NI drop this and use normal midi instead, I ask why? If you want to use midi you can, just plug in a midi controller and assign the control's.
if you want the more controllable audio method, you can do that too by using Rig Kontrol.

I say thank you NI for not making me purchase it separately. Shame I can't use Rig Control with my Legacy Collection for filter sweeps and stuff.

I do agree that there should be a software only version, for those who do not see the aliasing issue present in ALL MIDI controllers as a problem.

GR Crashing -
It has never happened to me (touch wood).
You really need an audio card with good quality ASIO drivers. Bad drivers cause more problems than anything else...ask any gamer, many of whom 'overclock' their machines for ultimate performance, and they will tell you how much using good drivers will improve your system stability.

I am using M-Audio delta 66 with an OMNI I/O attached, as well as Rig Kontrol, with Cubase SX3. Windows XP SP2 and P4 3.2 HT proc, 1 GB Ram.

Been making music seriously for about 4 years now, been playing guitar for around 18. I used the demo of this product with cubase vst5 and ableton. Used the plug to add effects to a clean recorded guitar plugged directly into the soundcard. Currently using amd 2.6 512ram RME 9632 into yamaha diamond 8.2 active monitors.

The GUI is fairly straight forward though the sample player was a bit confusing. The drag and drop interface, provided you know what you're looking for, seemed a good way to. No install problem. Because it was a demo i didn't have the footcontroller, which may have made some difference to the modulation and filter effects, but little else. It is not easy to get a good tune out of this software and it's nothing to do with the inferface, or the lack of a foot controller.

This is where the problem with most software/digital amp modellers occur. The tones are very flat, the distortions lifeless and the effects weak. The main problem is anyone that's worked with a tube amp, no matter how good or bad your guitar is, can get a richer sound out of it than this. You can tweak the distortions all you like, but they still sound muddy. Clean seems to have little effect on the signal as well, it all sounds so lifeless, the opposite to what a real tube amp sounds like. Amplitube has the same problem, tubifex is slightly better on clean settings, but again the distortions are poor on all of them.

For the money this costs you can buy a Sans Amp Tri AC, a dunlop cry baby, a boss dd3 and an akai intelliphase, money better spent. It didn't ever crash, it is a bit of a memory hog. Considering native instruments record with other software this has to come down as a big dissapointment. Amp modelling must be rock hard, because no software i've heard has managed to come close to the sound of a real amp. Shame.

Pro, player for over 30 years, author of Sheets of Sound for Guitar (www.sheetsofsound.net)

Very easy. I've never opened the manual.

Sound quality is excellent. I have 2 Fuchs amps and Allen Old Flame, Groove Tubes STPG1 and Mesa Studio Preamp. I've also owned and rebuilt original Marshall Plexi and many old BF Fender amps.

I'm going to give this a composite rating. 10 for the clean tones and 8 for the distorted tunes

It's expensive but believe me, it is the best modeler out there. I've owned them all including Line 6, Johnson, Yamaha, Vox and Behringer.

I'd give it a 10 but the price is a bit steep. I wish they'd make a hardware version.

I've been playing guitar for about 6 years now, I wouldn't say I'm a tone wizard but... I do have a clue of what I'm talking about.

I used my PodXT to plug in, using USB for the best latency. No sound... after pressing every button of GuitarRig I finally got some sound. It's not hard to work with, when it's working... but to make it work was another story. However this is just a case study and I don't thinks (at least I hope) this happens to most people.

The overall "Control Center" part is pretty self-explanatory, but the "Left View" isn't great.

Here's where it's all about. As I said, I used my PodXT to plugin. So I already had some good sounds at hand, but I wanted better possibilities. The reason for this is that we're going to record an album, with a very small budget. So modelling is the answer...well, it's not. It's fun to record your guitar at home, and you can get some very decent sounds out of the Pod, but it's not 'real'.

Back to GuitarRig - my saviour, as I thought it could be. I just plain sucks. I'm sorry but I can't refrase it, even if I would want to. Clean could be considered as OK, but it's got no life in it. It's just dead.

And Distortion? Well... I've heard clipped recording sound better, as a figure of speach. You really don't want to buy this, trust me.

After this review I'm going to have another crack at the Pod and see if there's a possibility of recording with it, or if we should just go to a studio, rent a Mesa and mic it. GuitarRig isn't even in the equation.

I have played guitar for 8 years and make a living as a sound engineer. I want to obtain some real feedback about NI GR but it seems that almost all the posts I read are by people comparing a PC program costing $500 to their $3000 rigs and rating the software unfairly. Please remember - IT IS A SOFTWARE PROGRAM designed to emulate guitar rigs and effects. Your real guitar rigs are played through 10" or 12" speakers and not a full-range, distortion free nearfield monitor that a computer musician would use. The presets are like any other bit of processing equipment - a starting point. Audio engineers always tweak the $1500 Lexicon or Yamaha reverb units because the presets are only a starting point. Guitar players even tweak the effects pedals because the settings on them when you open the box are not where you want them.
I am disgusted that their are guitarists who can even think about comparing this guitar rig software SIMULATOR to the well tuned rig via valve amps and double 12" cabinets. Of course GR through your PC speakers will not even come close to that. Instead, plug the PC audio output into your real rig to at least try and obtain a more realistic idea of what it really sounds like before giving it the thumbs down. Seek advice from the computer geek friends you know and the audio engineers around.

As a guitar player focused on computer based recording for over 10 years, my interest in software geared towards guitar players has always been an interest. I use Cubase as my main app, and record direct to disc. My goal is always to provide the most realistic recording possible without having to lug out my main rig. I record using a Mac G5 with 1 gig of ram and plenty of hard drives. I use a M-Audio Firewire 410,( not my first choice) the most affordable solution as my interface. My monitors are Genalec's 2029's (superb) which I have used for the last 3 years, so I know what sound I am looking for.

I was very excited to get Guitar rig based off all the hype. Being the first true I have to say the interface seemed more focus on computer enthusiast than the guitar player. Nonetheless, the install process on my Mac was a breeze, true plug and play. Yes I had to register the product before I could truly use it, but I understand why, with so many pirates out there who could blame them. Thank god for my engineer, he was able, (after 45 mins) to get me up and running

Once I launched the app I was ready to go. Being a computer novice I found the Guitar Rig a bit confusing. I did not get the layout of amp configurations nor did I understand How to change between the different selections to get the tones I was looking for.
I found the Manuel to be a little over my head, it seemed to be speaking to the computer player than a guitar player. I didn't even mind the toyish foot controller. Unfortunately I have to say I was disappointed, maybe because I expected so much. I heard everyone saying "Finally what a great break through for guitarist"! Well, I was not impressed, it sounded like my POD XT, my Sans Amp, and even my Amp Farm with some trick features. I am looking for a true guitar players software. One that speaks my language, and not the keyboard/computer musician. As a guitar player I need to see and feel what works for me. Unfortunately I could not return my product after I installed it. I might use it some day, but not today.

Overall, I felt the price I paid I could have bought me a whole lot of foot peadles the would have given me the same results. My faith that a computer based company like NI could make a guitar players software has now been knock down 2 notches. I was not impreesed by the tones nor was I impreased by the interface. The product wored fine and n=only crashed once(something I am use to). If I could change this product the forst thing I would do is change the interface, Not for guitar players. Two, I would change the foot pedal, to toyish.

Been playing in live /sequencer bands for 39 years,owned just about every guitar and amp ever worth buying.

I'm using Guitar Rig Live, yip guitar into laptop.

USING IT LIVE! If you use Guitar Rig the way I use it you will get the best guitar setup you have ever had,...i.e Guitar into an Echo Indigo I/O PCMCIA Card into PCMCIA slot of Acer P4 2.3Ghz Laptop set Echo card at 256 samples and analogue inputs 1/2 muted with ouput set to outputs 1/2 and 2 thru echo control panel.
Output from Indigo card in stereo into a Marshall 20w x 20w valve power amp feeding an old fender twin 2 x 12 cabinet with each speaker split to each output of Marshall power amp. NOTE: DO NOT USE A PRE-AMP JUST FEED OUTPUT FROM ECHO INDIGO CARD INTO STEREO IN'S ON POWER AMP!
Now try Guitar Rig,....you will be amazed!!!! awesome, screaming tone!

Don't use RIG KONTROL other than as a DI box as the thing is so unreliable it's hopeless for live work, instead use a midi foot control like the behringer or yamaha midi controller units which work great and don't let you down. The control via RIG CONTROL is a piece of total unreliable crap (NOTE: Not the Program which is great) what are you doing NI,... get this RIG KONTROL operating via midi and dump this input sensing circuit on one of the panned inputs, this is just useless crap, if you do this you will have the market in your hand if you read this about sending direct to a power amp and advise customers accordingly! Only 7 for this due to the crap RIG KONTROL! Get a midi controller instead!

Well you've already guessed, I think it is super for any style rock, metal, jazz, soul, pop, country etc. if you use Guitar Rig as I sugest you'll be well pleased. The Gratifier with the newly upgraded extra 20Db gain just makes this thing feedback on the notes sing and hang as long as you want, van halen, santana SRV great chorus reverb delays
cab sims, just great guitar, that what you want is'nt it!

Well worth the money except the RIG KONTROL which is not reliable, but you don't need this except as a DI box.
Tried and owned POD's ugghh sold on, tried Johnson, OWN Yamaha DG80 which is the best modeller amp out there, Now using Guitar Rig as described as above.
Software is very stable, uses around 20-25% CPU power with tweaked user presets.
Love the sound of this thing,... at last the thick valve sounds I've only dreamed about till now.
NOTE: For NATIVE INSTRUMENTS<... GET YOUR RIG KONTROL INTERFACE SORTED OUT, IT RUINS A GREAT PRODUCT !!!!

I've been playing guitar for over 40 years; mostly Flamenco, but I've always been interested in Metal, Rock tones. I recently bought a Yamaha Silent Guitar (nylon strings), which allows access to all the Guitar Rig tones without feedback.

I've tested GR with Fruity Loops, SONAR (Producer Edition), Ableton Live and a number of other hosts, and they all worked well

I'm running Guitar Rig on PC's; a 2.53 Ghz Tower, and a 2.53 Ghz Toshiba Media Edition Laptop; I have the VM3100 pro, but prefer using Line6 Guitar Port as input. (I also have a Boss GS-10 for comparison)

(Using GP, this software actually runs on an old Dell 800 Mhz (Inspiron 5000) as well; I was really surprised.)

I found the interface very intuitive, although I do think it could be improved (I REALLY like that of the GS-10, but I like the interface for GP better than GR). No problem at all installing the software, for either of my two main computers (I tested the demo version on the Inspiron 5000)

I found it very easy to get good sounds out of it; but then I also like GP and the GS-10. I haven't tried to automate it yet, so can't answer that one. The manual is OK, not spectacular....

I think the sound compares very favorably to GP and the GS-10, but I think those are fantastic (10's). I think this is very subjective, but certainly GR has the capabiity to tweak any parameter endlessly.

The Metal presets had a fair amount of noise as they tail off, but it may be my equipment - (especially the upgrade sounds). However, I will give GR the benefit of the doubt until I play a bit more with it.

I don't agree with Rob AT ALL, and I don't think many other people will have that experience. I would like the accompaniment track to time-slice the loops for a definite BPM (like Ableton), but of course I can use this with Ableton, so no real complaint there.

I love the many, many possible tone variations - I haven't even begun to check them out, but every parameter makes a difference so far. CPU is practically nothing with Guitar Port.

The neat thing about GP is if you run the software, you can mix and match GP and GR effects (you can probably also do that with the GS-10). These three units (GR, GP, and the GS-10) are really, really excellent, each in their own way.

I am a very, very happy camper.

No crashes